What's disheartening is that we have to do this "one at a time" with the full power of the institutional apparatus of our own country turned against us. A sane culture doesn't make people work individually to protect kids from harm though. A sane culture uses its institutions to provide that safety, not to undermine it while individual…
What's disheartening is that we have to do this "one at a time" with the full power of the institutional apparatus of our own country turned against us. A sane culture doesn't make people work individually to protect kids from harm though. A sane culture uses its institutions to provide that safety, not to undermine it while individual citizens try to stick their fingers in homemade dikes.
To be honest, this feels a lot like the pro-life movement did in the 90's or early 2000's. The wealthy and powerful were (and largely still are) arrayed against us then too. I hadn't really thought about the comparison until right now, but it really is quite similar. For someone who is pro-life, both issues revolve around protecting children. I know someone who's pro-choice doesn't see it that way, but someone who's pro-trans doesn't see it the way we do either. In that sense, both issues are also theological, questions about the nature of man, and both hinge on whether something "is right" with whether it is "a right". Side bar, I've noticed that the more obsessed people become with the second, the less they seem to care about the first.
Transgender ideology is part of the broader umbrella, at least from a source of funding / ideological perspective, of the billionaire class that still believes the long debunked Malthusian theory. The WEF. Soros and Gates and their cronies.
While the theory has been long debunked, its goal is depopulation and the values these people embrace are nihilism for thee, more money for me. Unfirtunanetly many who promote this insanity are stupid enough to actually believe existing humans can download their brains to computer programs and live forever because they don’t realize we are no closer to that in material reality than taking an afternoon trip to another galaxy. Covid terrified them because of the daily reminders they remain but mere mortals - and they took their hysteria out on children.
There is a lot of ideological crossover with the Covidians who used children’s bodies as a place to put their hysterical fear of a virus, the pro-abortion cried, the pro-gender ideology cried, and the pro-scarcity “climate warriors” who are in reality impoverishing people by embracing some of the least ecologically sound energy harnessing technology humans have pursued in the last 150 years. They are just relocating the pollution for their lifestyle to child slave labor Cobalt mines in the Congo or minority labor camps in China. Only an idiot prefers short lived batteries with scarce materials that can’t actually be recycled due to cross contamination of materials to low emission combustion engines, the 1,000 year supply of clean natural gas which can also be used for liquid hydrogen right here at home, and nuclear. These people are charging their electric cars from electricity produced at coal plants and diesel generators that work out to about 4 miles a gallon. They aren’t serious but they are destructive.
It all comes down to indoctrinating people not to pro-create and reject the family structure where it is most stable to have children and raise the next generation. They are vocally pro-abortion because the goal is to ensure fewer children. They don’t care if it’s murder. They are proud to promote child genital mutilation and sterilization. They are teaching a generation of mixed race kids to hate each other with insane neoracist “theories.”
These people really don’t care how much human suffering they cause nor do these woke fools care how flawed and disastrous their theories are. They clearly want sexual access to children because they get off on destroying kids. Outcomes do not get in the way of their ideas. Feeling like a baby god is the goal.
I am pro-choice early. I’m not a fan of living in a society where it’s legal to rip apart a living human who we know can feel every excruciating second of it, nor burning living babies alive in saline. There are over 45,000 abortions a year in this country after 15 weeks when we 100% know an abortion involves torturing a human being that can feel it to death. Planned Parenthood even admits over 97% of abortions after 20 weeks, of which there are over 11,000 a year in the US, are purely elective. 11,000 babies gruesomely murdered and these people cheer it on. There have been over 17,000 survivors of botched abortions since abortion was legalized in the US and every Democrat just voted to legalize infanticide by denying care to viable children who survive botched abortions.
I think at best most people are unaware of these basic factual realities because they just don’t care and can’t be bothered to consider actual reality when the propoganda narrative requires nothing from them except simple compliance. At worst they fully support it.
Pro-choicers are also concerned with protecting children -- protecting them from being born to someone who doesn't want them and will neglect or abuse them.
Yep, absolutely. Never sure why some people are too dense to get that. Whenever I see the Pray to End Abortion signs outside my local Catholic church, I'm always tempted to change them to Pray to End Unwanted Pregnancies (as in, support birth control and responsible, respectful sex). I can criticize Catholics, having been brought up most of my life in that huge cult.
I don't think ensuring that a baby is never born can be called protecting that baby, Cromulent, but I respect that pro-choicers think it is.
I really thought about not making this comparison since I didn't want to open the can of worms of abortion here, in a forum where there is likely disagreement on the issue. But the comparison (as someone who was involved in both movements) between the movements was too obvious. They really do FEEL similar internally, and I don't think that's just because many of the people happen to overlap.
Like abortion, I think reclaiming the binary nature of gender will be a long fight, much longer than many today realize. It took the postmodernists 60 years (dating from Foucault) to overturn the gender binary in law; we're not going to undo that in less than a generation.
You managed to open the can of worms anyway, so no turning back. You mighty not realize that the "pro-life" movement and the trans ideology movement have a lot in common. I'll leave you to figure out what that commonality is. What does the gender binary really mean to people like you, as it expresses itself in society at large?
It means that the words "man" and "woman" refer to something knowable in objective reality and are not simply arbitrary linguistic categories.
The postmodernists will defend gender fluidity all the way because they have to. Postmodernism is built on the idea that reality either nonexistent or unknowable, so language effectively creates reality. That's why a man (with a penis) who says he's a woman actually BECOMES a woman by that declaration.. But if "man" can refer to something real, then other words might also refer to something real, and any assertion that reality might be describable is like taking a block of C4 to the foundation of postmodernist theory. If "man" and "woman" are real things, maybe "baby" or "family" or "marriage" or "rights" or "right" and "wrong" might refer to real, objective, unchangeable things too. And we can't have that -- pretty soon we'll be talking about Plato's ideal table.
We're getting pretty deep into philosophical weeds here, but it's not an exaggeration to say that this is a conflict over whether objective reality exists or not. That conflict has been brewing for decades and happens to have come to a head with "what is a woman", but the philosophical conflict is much larger than that.
In that sense there are 2 agendas working in parallel, one philosophical and the other prurient. Both are wrapping themselves in the rainbow flag to keep prying eyes away from what's going on underneath.
Sorry for the long post, but you did ask. :-) And BTW: I don't need to agree with people on abortion or religion or philosophy to consider them friends, so please don't take anything I said personally.
In some respects I agree with what's in your post. However, the words "family" and "marriage," "rights," "right" and "wrong" at least do not refer to real, objective, unchangeable things except perhaps in your mind. I know what they mean to me, and am sure what they mean to me is very different from what they mean to you. That's kind of what I meant by people like you and the trans cult having more in common than you realize. BTW, nothing wrong with the original rainbow flag, that is, the flag as first designed, before the TQ+ nonsense inserted itself. Never was, never will be.
If "human rights" don't refer to something objectively real, we're all in big trouble. Any right created by man can be removed by man, which means it can't be a "universal human right".
I would suggest that your own definitions here will make it very hard for you to successfully push back on the trans cult. You have already conceded most of the linguistic battlefield. And that's where this battle is being fought.
But those Tri-flags and "All gender" restroom signs on single occupancy WCs need to go! "Toilet" would do...
People might have different ideas about "family" and "marriage" but I don't think one can really compare those who prefer a traditional view of these to those who groom and drug & mutilate children with a non-scientific ideology, IMO... I can understand if you are offended on behalf of the original flag. But, we all do see an awful lot of it these days. I'm rainbowed out :-) I think Andrew Sullivan has written about this burn out.
This makes absolutely no sense in any way possible without resorting to postmodern language. You can't conflate your way towards a meaningful conjoinment of the two.
What does the gender binary mean....What a useless question. And please refrain from making comments like "mean to people like you?" It paints you as an irritant and disdainful clod.
I feel bad for Abigail Shrier that her well-written, thoughtful article attracted readers like you. You think I'm an irritant and a disdainful clod. So be it, since I wouldn't want the good opinion of a nitwit like you. Tit for tat, how's that? But I am glad that my comment got under the skins of some of the commenters here. It did its job then. You think this is a simple semi-abstract issue to discuss and everyone should agree with you? You felt entitled to misinterpret the intent of my question about the "gender binary" (actually "sex binary" is the only meaningful term and I'm all for respecting that). The current Western gender cult includes the traditional adult male value system, whether you realize it or not. It harms mostly women and children and gay people and I think you're in none of those categories. You sound like a man with "traditional" values, just a few steps away from an MRA. Just the feeling I get though, You're free to prove me wrong.
Idiocracy lives here. Both of my friends whose kids were trafficked were from intact liberal leaning families. You and others who think like you do live in a bubble or retirement village and not in the real world.
I am pro choice - your comment is ridiculous. Looking at the pandemic responses every adult in this Country failed the children - we are their examples.
What's disheartening is that we have to do this "one at a time" with the full power of the institutional apparatus of our own country turned against us. A sane culture doesn't make people work individually to protect kids from harm though. A sane culture uses its institutions to provide that safety, not to undermine it while individual citizens try to stick their fingers in homemade dikes.
To be honest, this feels a lot like the pro-life movement did in the 90's or early 2000's. The wealthy and powerful were (and largely still are) arrayed against us then too. I hadn't really thought about the comparison until right now, but it really is quite similar. For someone who is pro-life, both issues revolve around protecting children. I know someone who's pro-choice doesn't see it that way, but someone who's pro-trans doesn't see it the way we do either. In that sense, both issues are also theological, questions about the nature of man, and both hinge on whether something "is right" with whether it is "a right". Side bar, I've noticed that the more obsessed people become with the second, the less they seem to care about the first.
Transgender ideology is part of the broader umbrella, at least from a source of funding / ideological perspective, of the billionaire class that still believes the long debunked Malthusian theory. The WEF. Soros and Gates and their cronies.
While the theory has been long debunked, its goal is depopulation and the values these people embrace are nihilism for thee, more money for me. Unfirtunanetly many who promote this insanity are stupid enough to actually believe existing humans can download their brains to computer programs and live forever because they don’t realize we are no closer to that in material reality than taking an afternoon trip to another galaxy. Covid terrified them because of the daily reminders they remain but mere mortals - and they took their hysteria out on children.
There is a lot of ideological crossover with the Covidians who used children’s bodies as a place to put their hysterical fear of a virus, the pro-abortion cried, the pro-gender ideology cried, and the pro-scarcity “climate warriors” who are in reality impoverishing people by embracing some of the least ecologically sound energy harnessing technology humans have pursued in the last 150 years. They are just relocating the pollution for their lifestyle to child slave labor Cobalt mines in the Congo or minority labor camps in China. Only an idiot prefers short lived batteries with scarce materials that can’t actually be recycled due to cross contamination of materials to low emission combustion engines, the 1,000 year supply of clean natural gas which can also be used for liquid hydrogen right here at home, and nuclear. These people are charging their electric cars from electricity produced at coal plants and diesel generators that work out to about 4 miles a gallon. They aren’t serious but they are destructive.
It all comes down to indoctrinating people not to pro-create and reject the family structure where it is most stable to have children and raise the next generation. They are vocally pro-abortion because the goal is to ensure fewer children. They don’t care if it’s murder. They are proud to promote child genital mutilation and sterilization. They are teaching a generation of mixed race kids to hate each other with insane neoracist “theories.”
These people really don’t care how much human suffering they cause nor do these woke fools care how flawed and disastrous their theories are. They clearly want sexual access to children because they get off on destroying kids. Outcomes do not get in the way of their ideas. Feeling like a baby god is the goal.
I am pro-choice early. I’m not a fan of living in a society where it’s legal to rip apart a living human who we know can feel every excruciating second of it, nor burning living babies alive in saline. There are over 45,000 abortions a year in this country after 15 weeks when we 100% know an abortion involves torturing a human being that can feel it to death. Planned Parenthood even admits over 97% of abortions after 20 weeks, of which there are over 11,000 a year in the US, are purely elective. 11,000 babies gruesomely murdered and these people cheer it on. There have been over 17,000 survivors of botched abortions since abortion was legalized in the US and every Democrat just voted to legalize infanticide by denying care to viable children who survive botched abortions.
I think at best most people are unaware of these basic factual realities because they just don’t care and can’t be bothered to consider actual reality when the propoganda narrative requires nothing from them except simple compliance. At worst they fully support it.
So well said. 👏🏻
Pro-choicers are also concerned with protecting children -- protecting them from being born to someone who doesn't want them and will neglect or abuse them.
Yep, absolutely. Never sure why some people are too dense to get that. Whenever I see the Pray to End Abortion signs outside my local Catholic church, I'm always tempted to change them to Pray to End Unwanted Pregnancies (as in, support birth control and responsible, respectful sex). I can criticize Catholics, having been brought up most of my life in that huge cult.
I don't think ensuring that a baby is never born can be called protecting that baby, Cromulent, but I respect that pro-choicers think it is.
I really thought about not making this comparison since I didn't want to open the can of worms of abortion here, in a forum where there is likely disagreement on the issue. But the comparison (as someone who was involved in both movements) between the movements was too obvious. They really do FEEL similar internally, and I don't think that's just because many of the people happen to overlap.
Like abortion, I think reclaiming the binary nature of gender will be a long fight, much longer than many today realize. It took the postmodernists 60 years (dating from Foucault) to overturn the gender binary in law; we're not going to undo that in less than a generation.
You managed to open the can of worms anyway, so no turning back. You mighty not realize that the "pro-life" movement and the trans ideology movement have a lot in common. I'll leave you to figure out what that commonality is. What does the gender binary really mean to people like you, as it expresses itself in society at large?
It means that the words "man" and "woman" refer to something knowable in objective reality and are not simply arbitrary linguistic categories.
The postmodernists will defend gender fluidity all the way because they have to. Postmodernism is built on the idea that reality either nonexistent or unknowable, so language effectively creates reality. That's why a man (with a penis) who says he's a woman actually BECOMES a woman by that declaration.. But if "man" can refer to something real, then other words might also refer to something real, and any assertion that reality might be describable is like taking a block of C4 to the foundation of postmodernist theory. If "man" and "woman" are real things, maybe "baby" or "family" or "marriage" or "rights" or "right" and "wrong" might refer to real, objective, unchangeable things too. And we can't have that -- pretty soon we'll be talking about Plato's ideal table.
We're getting pretty deep into philosophical weeds here, but it's not an exaggeration to say that this is a conflict over whether objective reality exists or not. That conflict has been brewing for decades and happens to have come to a head with "what is a woman", but the philosophical conflict is much larger than that.
In that sense there are 2 agendas working in parallel, one philosophical and the other prurient. Both are wrapping themselves in the rainbow flag to keep prying eyes away from what's going on underneath.
Sorry for the long post, but you did ask. :-) And BTW: I don't need to agree with people on abortion or religion or philosophy to consider them friends, so please don't take anything I said personally.
In some respects I agree with what's in your post. However, the words "family" and "marriage," "rights," "right" and "wrong" at least do not refer to real, objective, unchangeable things except perhaps in your mind. I know what they mean to me, and am sure what they mean to me is very different from what they mean to you. That's kind of what I meant by people like you and the trans cult having more in common than you realize. BTW, nothing wrong with the original rainbow flag, that is, the flag as first designed, before the TQ+ nonsense inserted itself. Never was, never will be.
If "human rights" don't refer to something objectively real, we're all in big trouble. Any right created by man can be removed by man, which means it can't be a "universal human right".
I would suggest that your own definitions here will make it very hard for you to successfully push back on the trans cult. You have already conceded most of the linguistic battlefield. And that's where this battle is being fought.
"linguistic battlefield" indeed. We are in a war of words. I have few that I play with for humour and truth.
https://alphaandomegacloud.wordpress.com/2022/12/29/transgender-and-other-trans-words-definitions/
But those Tri-flags and "All gender" restroom signs on single occupancy WCs need to go! "Toilet" would do...
People might have different ideas about "family" and "marriage" but I don't think one can really compare those who prefer a traditional view of these to those who groom and drug & mutilate children with a non-scientific ideology, IMO... I can understand if you are offended on behalf of the original flag. But, we all do see an awful lot of it these days. I'm rainbowed out :-) I think Andrew Sullivan has written about this burn out.
This makes absolutely no sense in any way possible without resorting to postmodern language. You can't conflate your way towards a meaningful conjoinment of the two.
What does the gender binary mean....What a useless question. And please refrain from making comments like "mean to people like you?" It paints you as an irritant and disdainful clod.
I feel bad for Abigail Shrier that her well-written, thoughtful article attracted readers like you. You think I'm an irritant and a disdainful clod. So be it, since I wouldn't want the good opinion of a nitwit like you. Tit for tat, how's that? But I am glad that my comment got under the skins of some of the commenters here. It did its job then. You think this is a simple semi-abstract issue to discuss and everyone should agree with you? You felt entitled to misinterpret the intent of my question about the "gender binary" (actually "sex binary" is the only meaningful term and I'm all for respecting that). The current Western gender cult includes the traditional adult male value system, whether you realize it or not. It harms mostly women and children and gay people and I think you're in none of those categories. You sound like a man with "traditional" values, just a few steps away from an MRA. Just the feeling I get though, You're free to prove me wrong.
Killing is protection? 😬
Idiocracy lives here. Both of my friends whose kids were trafficked were from intact liberal leaning families. You and others who think like you do live in a bubble or retirement village and not in the real world.
I am pro choice - your comment is ridiculous. Looking at the pandemic responses every adult in this Country failed the children - we are their examples.